TOWN OF OLD SAYBROOK
Inland Wetlands & Watercourses Commission
302 Main Street Old Saybrook, Connecticut 06475-1741
MINUTES
PUBLIC HEARING – “THE PRESERVE”
THURSDAY, December 22, 2005 at 7:30 p.m.
OLD SAYBROOK MIDDLE SCHOOL
60 SHEFFIELD SREET
CALL TO ORDER- Acting Chairman, Robert McIntyre, called the public hearing to order at 7:30 p.m. at the Old Saybrook Middle School.
ROLL CALL
Attendant Members Absent Members
Robert McIntyre, Planning Rep. Paul Smith, Vice Chairman
William Pollock, Regular Member Kevin Zawoy, Regular Member
Judy Preston, Conservation Rep. Brendan McKeown, Alt. Member
Charles Sohl, Zoning Representative
Frank Reichart, Economic Development Rep.
Kim Gallagher, Alternate Member
Town Staff and Consultants
Damon Hearne, Acting Clerk/Wetlands Enforcement Officer
Kati Drzewianowski, Consulting Civil Engineer
Wade Thomas, Consulting Civil Engineer
Dr. A. Martin Petrovic, Consulting Turfgrass Scientst
Juliet McKenna Consulting Hydrogeologist
Mary Armstrong Consulting Golf Course Architect
Michael Cronin, Esq. Consulting Legal Counsel
Geoffrey Jacobson, Consulting Civil Engineer
Christine Nelson, Town Planner
Penelope Sharp, Consulting Biologist and Wetlands Scientist
R. Richard Snarski, Consulting Soil & Wetlands Scientist
PUBLIC HEARING
05-016 “The Preserve” – River Sound Development, LLC.
Application to construct open space subdivision, country club, golf course
community (934 ac. total) & open space (542.2 ac.) within 100 ft of wetlands.
(114.5 acres total wetlands)
Residence Conservation C District, Aquifer Protection District
Applicant: River Sound Development, LLC. Agent: Attorney David Royston
Acting Chairman Robert McIntyre reconvened the public hearing and outlined the hearing subject. McIntyre reviewed the schedule for the evening noting that the applicant would have a brief 10 minute presentation, the Public would have 1 hour for questions, intervener Connecticut Fund for the Environment (CFE) would have a 20-30 minute presentation, and the Commission would have the remaining time for questions. Chairman McIntyre also noted that the hearing would continue on January 5, 2006.
Attorney Royston, representative for the applicant, entered into the record a request and consent to continue the hearing until January 12, 2006.
Mr. Goderre, project manager for the applicant, presented an updated and detailed construction sequence for the golf course. He emphasized that the sequence would attempt to avoid damage to wildlife as much as possible.
The public portion of the hearing was then opened.
Danny Redak, Old Saybrook, stated his concern for illegal encroachment into the buffer zones, and stated that the property was the largest pristine designated conservative area left in Connecticut. He stated that Old Saybrook will never be the same if the Preserve is allowed.
Newell Curtis, Essex Rd in Westbrook, stated concerns regarding water well issues.
Carol Manning, Main St, Old Saybrook, asked questions regarding DEP permits and public health permits that she had asked 3-4 weeks prior and asked if the IWWC had been in contact with DEP. Chairman McIntyre stated that he did not know of any contact between DEP and the IWWC.
Troy Foreman spoke in favor of the project stating that the offer of open space is generous and that owners of land can do what they want within reason.
Steven Tagliatela, Marine Point Drive, Old Saybrook, read a letter in support of the Preserve and listed ways that the project would be beneficial.
Seeing no more questions from the public, Chairman McIntyre then closed the public portion of the hearing.
Commissioner Gallagher asked Dr. Stuart Cohen, consultant for the applicant, detailed questions regarding precipitation numbers, impact of snow and ice on the septic leach fields. Dr. Cohen responded to these questions. Ms. Gallagher and Mr. Cohen then discussed additional detail of the septic systems including nitrate concentrations, seasonal fluctuation of pH levels, and phosphorus. Consultants for the town Mr. Thomas, Ms. Sharp and Mr. Snarski also stated their concern regarding changes to the Pequot Swamp if pH was altered due to nutrient inputs.
Mr. Reichart asked questions regarding rock blasting and calculation of groundwater flow. Dennis Goderre answered these questions with the assistance of Sam Haydock, hydrologist for the applicant.
Mr. Pollock asked several questions regarding blasting details on the site and the effect of the blasting on natural groundwater flow. Mr. Goderre and John Dugan, blasting engineer for the applicant replied to these questions. Mr. Pollock followed up with several clarifying questions which were also addressed. Mr. Goderre clarified the amount of blasting to take place within 25 and 100 ft buffer zones of the vernal pools.
Mr. Sohl asked if anyone had tested productivity impact on vernal pools and referenced papers produced by Dr. Klemens, herpetologist for the applicant. He also asked about use of lime and other chemicals to alter pH of the golf course turf. Dr. Klemens replied to these questions stating that sites of this size were unique and not often tested but that his research showed that the BMP’s should work. He also clarified that creation of new vernal pools is extremely difficult if not impossible. Dr. Cohen replied that lime applied to the turf is not mobile and that the soils have a great buffering capability. Mr. Goderre also addressed several points regarding proposed alternatives included in Mr. Sohl’s letter submitted at the public hearing.
Mr. Pollock clarified several questions regarding blasting on given golf holes.
Ms. Preston asked several questions to Dr. Klemens regarding the relationship between wetlands and forests and habitat use vernal pool species. She also asked Dr. Klemens questions regarding test sites for the BMP’s, edge effects on wildlife, and the potentially experimental nature of the Preserve design. Dr. Klemens addressed these issues and emphasized that he had plenty of negative data that indicated that the BMP’s would be successful.
Ms. Preston then asked Mr. Klein, consultant for the applicant, regarding temperature changes in the wetlands due to clearing of canopy. Mr. Klein responded to these questions.
Dr. Cohen then stated that he had researched impacts to invertebrates by the golf course pesticides at the request of the Commission. He stated that one additional pesticide had been removed from the approved chemical list because of its potential harm to insects.
The Commission then passed the following motion:
MOTION to continue the Preserve Public Hearing through January 12, 2006 MOVED by Robert McIntyre. SECONDED by Judy Preson.
IN FAVOR: R. McIntyre, W. Pollock, J. Preston, K. Gallagher, C. Sohl, F. Reichart. OPPOSED: none. ABSTAINING: none. APPROVED: 6-0-0
Attorney Charles Rothenberger, Connecticut Fund for the Environment, Inc., made a brief statement covering issues of the commission ability to deny the application due to adverse impacts, and stated that the commission should require the applicant to show all impacts and grading on the site outside of the upland review area as well.
George Logan, of REMA Ecological Services, testified on behalf of CFE. Mr. Logan reviewed revision to the golf course and outlined his report that was submitted to the commission. Sigrum Gadwa, also of REMA Ecological Services, then spoke briefly regarding natural seeps containing dusky salamanders and issues of concentrated inputs to seeps and small streams.
Attorney Matt Ranelli, representing Town of Essex, asked of the Old Saybrook Town consultants if there was an adverse effect to the vernal pools. Mr. Snarski and Ms. Sharp stated that there would be an adverse effect.
Sam Stern, representing the applicant, then addressed issues of golf course design and housing types. Mr. Stern stated that a 9 hole golf course was not marketable and outlined the reasons why the current configuration was necessary for viability of the project.
The consultants for the Town were then asked if there were any additional concerns or topics that they would like to discuss.
Mr. Thomas, consulting civil engineer for the Town, stated concerns regarding reconstitution of effluent and the timing of effluent discharge. Mr. McIntyre asked is Mr. Thomas knew of a way to control for these concerns. Mr. Thomas replied that more information was needed on the soil hydraulic capacities.
Mr. Pollock asked of Mr. Thomas what would happen downstream if Pequot Swamp was compromised. Mr. Snarski replied for the Town consultants that they were more concerned with what would happen in the swamp, not downstream. Mr. McIntyre then asked for Mr. Snarski’s assessment of the effluent issue. Mr. Snarski stated that more information was needed on soils.
Mr. Snarski asked Dr. Klemens if there would be changes to the vernal pool chemistry and water quality. Dr. Klemens replied that some of the non-conserved pools will change in water chemistry, and that the conserved pools will not change significantly. Mr. Snarski also asked questions regarding de-icing salt on vernal pools. Dr. Klemens stated that he did not know the effects of de-icing salt. Dr. Klemens and Mr. Snarski discussed with some detail the proximity of roads to vernal pools and issues of nutrient cycling and potential changes.
Ms. Sharp stated several questions regarding vegetation types under cart path bridges and types of vegetation expected under the carp path crossings. Mr. Goderre and Mr. Klein responded to these questions for the applicant.
Martin Malin, project engineer for the applicant, replied for the applicant regarding questions raised by Mr. Thomas on issues of septic effluent reconstitution and engineering solutions to the septic effluent problems.
Dr. Cohen addressed the issues of pH changes and stated that there was no evidence that the pH would change.
Mr. McIntyre asked the Town consultants to compare house lawn fertilization to golf course use. Mr. Snarski stated that analysis could be done on this only if certain parameters were set. He further stated that any estimation on these questions was difficult because of unknown factors.
Dr. Petrovic, turf scientist for the Town, stated that he had seen evidence from a stream and runoff study that developed areas input less nitrogen than forested areas but do release more phosphorus. He stated that a highly fertilized lawn can be a nitrogen sink.
Mr. Haydock, for the applicant, compared community and individual septic systems and referred to his December 1st presentation on this topic.
Ms. Gallagher stated that an application with a conventional house design would receive the same scrutiny that the current applicant was getting. She then asked several questions of the Town consultants regarding the mixing of Pequot swamp, and the impacts on the edges of the bog due to nitrogen inputs. Mr. Snarski replied to these questions in part, and after some discussion between Attorney Rothenberger, the acting Chairman, and Attorney Cronin, counsel for the Town, CFE’s consultants were also allowed to comment. Ms. Gadwa described the changes that could occur due to nitrogen inputs to the swamp.
Dr. Cohen then addressed Ms. Gallagher’s questions regarding nitrogen inputs.
The meeting was then adjourned by the Chairman to resume Thursday, December 22, 2005 at 7:30 p.m. at the Old Saybrook Middle School, Old Saybrook CT.
Respectfully submitted,
Damon Hearne
Acting Clerk
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